Vegetable growing

[Starman]

Good one Starman, but one thing/comment.

But what do they do when the "Pond" runs out of water ?

This year the Water Level in the River here in the Area is extremely low and also the "Ponds" (which some farmers have) are completely empty, even some wells that people have (Pig farmers), have run dry and that was during the rainy season

Fortunate our well (which was dug during the top of the "Hot" season) hasn't run dry but here it's a hit and miss what kind of water (Salty (strange enough, which is AFAIK no good for RICE) or Not) you get when drilling a well.

Tip: When you drill a well, please get them to agree to a "Good Water" guarantee. And when they hit water at lets say 30 meters deep, let them drill another 5-10 meters deeper. And last one, dig a well at end of the "Hot/Dry" Season (but I think that's obvious )

7 years in and the pond has never been empty. This year, as you have reported has been a particularly bad year, and the pond is not empty.

[iammike]

So it totally depends on the area, unfortunately there is no One size fits all solution.

BIL is thinking of diversifying (which IMHO he needs to (but I don?t take part in the discussion;)) but it?s very hard for them to abondon Rice (my FIL (80+ year old) is absolutely against it

[iammike]

<snip>
This year, as you have reported has been a particularly bad year, and the pond is not empty.

Could it be that his pond automatically is replenished (via ground water) ?? (I believe in Thai it's Called Naam Boh)

If so, then he is very lucky, there are some of these in our Amphur and the people that have those sell the water as "drinking" water (1300 liters for 160-200 THB).

[Starman]

<snip>
This year, as you have reported has been a particularly bad year, and the pond is not empty.

Could it be that his pond automatically is replenished (via ground water) ?? (I believe in Thai it's Called Naam Boh)

I don't recall seeing water in the newly dug pond prior to the monsoons so I don't think it has hit the water table. The pond is in the region of 15 to 20 metres deep. That is more likely the reason it is never empty. I would imagine that depth would work any where.

[nanglong218]

Water storage on a scale to irrigate several rai will take a lot of big dams/ponds. Strange, I left Sept 24 and it had been a wet summer.  Our 5 to 6000 litres of tanks were full.  Everything looked good.  That water can't help the rice so it will keep our Tilapia tanks alive plus the market garden.
After 13 years in Australia I'm obsessive about water, its shortage causes poverty and despair.

[Starman]

Water storage on a scale to irrigate several rai will take a lot of big dams/ponds. Strange, I left Sept 24 and it had been a wet summer.  Our 5 to 6000 litres of tanks were full.  Everything looked good.  That water can't help the rice so it will keep our Tilapia tanks alive plus the market garden.
After 13 years in Australia I'm obsessive about water, its shortage causes poverty and despair.

Like I said before, the project initiated by the King suggested 1/4 of rice land should be turned over to water storage. Those that have done that in our area have not lost a crop for many years now.

[iammike]

<snip>

Like I said before, the project initiated by the King suggested 1/4 of rice land should be turned over to water storage. Those that have done that in our area have not lost a crop for many years now.

I suspect it will work what you say, but in so many places its that they first have to see that it works (read make a profit) before they will commit to sacrificing 1/4 of their land.

TiT

[Starman]

<snip>

Like I said before, the project initiated by the King suggested 1/4 of rice land should be turned over to water storage. Those that have done that in our area have not lost a crop for many years now.

I suspect it will work what you say, but in so many places its that they first have to see that it works (read make a profit) before they will commit to sacrificing 1/4 of their land.

TiT

I am surprised that people would not believe. It was a very well publisised project initiated by the most revered king in the history of Thailand. It's a shame that some folks can't see the need to change their ways for the better, and I don't mean that in a condescending way.

[nanglong218]

Sacrificing growing land for water is obviously a trade off.  Will it work long term asks the farmer?  A friend of mine in upcountry Victoria says evaporation is his biggest problem when the sun is high and the air is dry.  Everyday his water level has fallen.  If water can be conserved during Oct/Nov then there may be a chance of saving the harvest.

[iammike]

<snip>

Like I said before, the project initiated by the King suggested 1/4 of rice land should be turned over to water storage. Those that have done that in our area have not lost a crop for many years now.

I suspect it will work what you say, but in so many places its that they first have to see that it works (read make a profit) before they will commit to sacrificing 1/4 of their land.

TiT

I am surprised that people would not believe. It was a very well publisised project initiated by the most revered king in the history of Thailand. It's a shame that some folks can't see the need to change their ways for the better, and I don't mean that in a condescending way.

I agree with you, but that?s just the way it is here unfortunately.

[Starman]

Sacrificing growing land for water is obviously a trade off.  Will it work long term asks the farmer?  A friend of mine in upcountry Victoria says evaporation is his biggest problem when the sun is high and the air is dry.  Everyday his water level has fallen.  If water can be conserved during Oct/Nov then there may be a chance of saving the harvest.

A farmer cannot grow rice without water or with too much water. So.....sacrifice 1/4 of growing land to save a crop or just keep planting year after year with the possibility of losing 100%? The point is that my father in law and some other farmers in our area took the decision to dig a pond for water management. Their crops have been good for the drought and the flood years. They listened to reasoning. What happened to those that didn't??

[nanglong218]

I agree Starman.     But the bank comes before the King's advice.
I spent far too many hours at the land office in Lamplaimat where mama was subdividing the family land into small uneconomic plots shared among her children.  A recipe for continual poverty, lack of investment and imagination resulting in subsistence farming. 

[Starman]

I agree Starman.     But the bank comes before the King's advice.
I spent far too many hours at the land office in Lamplaimat where mama was subdividing the family land into small uneconomic plots shared among her children.  A recipe for continual poverty, lack of investment and imagination resulting in subsistence farming. 

I think you are missing the point. The whole idea of the King's project was to get the farmers out of debt. To ensure that banks were not a factor. Other parts of the scheme were to use fish and buffalo dung in the paddies instead of chemicals. To save seed from one crop to plant the next year. Some listened and some didn't.

Your example is classic. Siblings fighting over what they perceive to be theirs instead of working together. I'm not sure that rice farming alone send folks here into poverty, but rather the denial of the need to think ahead.

[Tassie]

Show me a successful small (under 20 Rai) rice farmer and I will show you 100 that are continual failures.  Rice farming on small acreage for commercial gain is a slippery slope to continuous poverty. Even if one has  a bumper crop, there is not enough profit to be made to keep one out of poverty unless they have another income source.
Regards

[Freddy]

Crazy how land is divided up here. What happens with the next generation?? Divide what's already been divided again??

Bad rice seasons aside, the approach that many families have won't sustain much longer anyway. Lifestyle expectations and general cost of living is gaining pace  here and a small rice crop is no longer able to support a family even if it is a good year. Same as has happened in the UK and all over the world. The big boys will survive and slowly take over.