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Poll

SHOULD THE GUN LAWS BE CHANGED IN AMERICA

YES
25 (80.6%)
NO
6 (19.4%)

Total Members Voted: 31

Author Topic: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA  (Read 167264 times)

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Offline gotlost

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #180 on: December 30, 2012, 11:15:37 AM »
Gunman's neighbor arrested in connection with firefighter ambushBy CNN Staff
December 29, 2012 -- Updated 0200 GMT (1000 HKT)
Gunman's neighbor arrestedSTORY HIGHLIGHTS
NEW: The woman was a neighbor of the gunman who ambushed firefighters
Dawn Nguyen of Rochester, New York, faces charges of filing a falsified business record
Nguyen's attorney was not immediately available to comment
New York (CNN) -- The gunman who ambushed and killed two unsuspecting firefighters as they battled a blaze in upstate New York couldn't buy his weapons legally so he allegedly got his neighbor's daughter to purchase them for him, said U.S. Attorney William Hochul.

Dawn Nguyen of Rochester, New York, faces charges over allegedly lying when she purchased an AR-15 rifle -- a .223-caliber weapon -- and 12-gauge shotgun that the gunman had with him during the attack.

Authorities say she told the gun dealer that she planned to be the owner of the weapons, but had instead purchased them on June 7, 2010,for gunman William Spengler.

"It is absolutely against federal law to lie relating to the acquisition of firearms," said Hochul, who said Spengler indicated in a suicide note that he had gotten the weapons from the neighbor.

Dispatcher told firefighter: 'Brother, hang tight'

Nguyen, 24, was "turned ... over to ATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives) agents to be processed at the federal level, and arraigned by a federal magistrate this afternoon," according to state police Investigator James Newell.


Firefighters honor fallen comrades Spengler, 62 -- who had been convicted of killing his grandmother decades ago -- used the same type of weapon employed in the recent assault on Sandy Hook Elementary School, which left 26 people dead, including 20 children. As a convicted felon, Spengler was not allowed to legally possess weapons.

Autopsy shows suspect died of self-inflicted wound

"He was equipped to go to war," Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering said. The gunman was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot wound hours later.

In his possession were three firearms, including two .223-caliber Bushmaster rifles and a Mossberg 12-gauge shotgun. While Nguyen's charges involve two weapons, authorities indicated the possibility of additional charges regarding the third weapon.

Nguyen's attorney was not immediately available for comment. If convicted, she could face up to 10 years in jail and $250,000 fine.

CNN's Kristina Sgueglia and Laura Ly contributed to this report.


Offline nookiebear

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #181 on: December 30, 2012, 11:21:28 AM »
Urleft will pay the fine!!

Offline urleft

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #182 on: December 30, 2012, 07:59:01 PM »
Urleft will pay the fine!!

Why would I pay the fine?  I think it was pretty stupid (and criminal) for her to buy the weapons for another individual. 

Now if someone had illegally brought a weapon into Sandy Hook GUN FREE ZONE  and took out the prep, I would be donating to their fine.

Offline nookiebear

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #183 on: December 30, 2012, 08:21:04 PM »
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??

Offline CO-CO

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #184 on: December 30, 2012, 08:32:25 PM »
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??
e


Tough one that. Any clues?

Is Jones the Rice in the frame?

Offline Somnat

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #185 on: December 30, 2012, 08:37:38 PM »
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??

Italian Tony  :wacko:

Just Joking, feeling kinda sporty tonight


Offline urleft

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #186 on: December 30, 2012, 08:43:17 PM »
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??

Well it's not me, I voted yes. 


Offline TBWG

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #187 on: December 30, 2012, 08:45:24 PM »
'US Can Learn From Australia's Gun Laws'
Former Oz PM John Howard who introduced tough laws after 35 people were shot dead says now is the time for America to act.6:45am UK, Sunday 30 December 2012


By Jonathan Samuels, Australia Correspondent

When Martin Bryant massacred 35 people with semi-automatic weapons at a tourist spot in Tasmania in 1996, then-Australian prime minister John Howard reacted swiftly by pushing for tough new national gun laws.

Just 12 days after the shootings at Port Arthur, legislation was agreed which banned most people from owning rapid fire rifles and shotguns.

In a government buyback scheme more than 600,000 weapons were handed in and destroyed.

There have been no mass killings since.

Neil Noye was the local Mayor at the time. Speaking to Channel 9 about the recent US killings he said: "It's devastating and my thoughts and prayers go out to those families because I know exactly what they are going through.

"John Howard brought the gun laws in. Some people hated him and some people loved him, but I think that was a good thing."

Now US President Barack Obama is facing the same dilemma after the Newtown school massacre in Connecticut that killed 20 children and six adults.


The 1996 massacre in Tasmania sparked anti-gun protests
While the gun lobby is far more powerful in the US and gun ownership culturally embedded through the constitution, the conservative Mr Howard says now is the time to tackle the politically sensitive issue.

"It will be difficult but it can be done," Mr Howard, who had only been in the job two months when the Port Arthur killings happened, told Sydney's Daily Telegraph.

Speaking earlier this year after another US gun massacre, Mr Howard noted: "If I hadn't done something I would have been squandering the moral authority I had as a newly-elected prime minister."

Australian MP Andrew Leigh has studied and written about the effects of the legislation.

"One in three American households has a gun, and that has terrible consequences when a teenager gets depressed or a family dispute gets out of control," he said.

"There are Australians who wouldn't be walking the streets if it wasn't for the gun buyback. It saved about 200 lives a year it continues to make Australia a safer place today."

The politician believes America can learn a great deal from the Australian experience and says the US "can recognise that you can have both - you can have that culture of sport shooting that Americans prize so dearly but without the tragic gun violence that plagues so many American lives every year".

In 2009 in Australia there were 0.1 gun murders per 100,000 people compared to 3.2 per 100,000 in the US, according to the most recent data from the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime.

Philip Alpers, an analyst on gun violence at the University of Sydney who worked on weapons control in the US for four years, admits drawing parallels between Australia and US is difficult.

"Culturally we are very different. The automatic Australian reaction after Port Arthur was that we need to pull back on gun ownership -  fewer guns are better. Howard had a groundswell of public support on his side," he said.

"In the US, reaction over the past few years has increasingly been, more guns make us safer. Guns are confused with freedom and opinion is so polarised that it might be impossible for Obama to do anything."

Not everyone in Australia has been convinced by the legislation.


The Australian government bought back guns and destroyed them
Colourful independent MP in rural Queensland, Bob Katter, said: "You can ban all the guns in the world but those sort of people find some other way of doing it.

"You create a morbid fascination when you ban them and I think that has a lot to do with some of these terrible incidents that are occurring."

The Sporting Shooters Association of Australia, which lobbied against the Howard laws, says gun death rates were falling anyway.

It points to an independent report by the Melbourne Institute in 2008 which contradicts claims that fewer guns mean fewer homicides and suicides.

"There is little evidence to suggest that it had any significant effects on firearm homicides and suicides," the Melbourne study concluded, referring to the National Firearms Agreement.

Australia still has gun crime of course, especially amongst Sydney's biker gangs, but since Port Arthur no Australian shooting has made global headlines.

Unlike in America guns aren't entwined in Australia's culture, but changing gun laws was still a brave move, as politicians in Washington know all too well.


TBWG buriram_united sawadi

Offline pablo

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #188 on: December 30, 2012, 08:51:23 PM »
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??

'twasn't me either.

I'm all for loosening (changing) the laws, just a little.

Could use me one of those RPG launchers/ammo...and maybe a few "claymore's" to hang around the front of the house.    :o


« Last Edit: December 30, 2012, 08:57:42 PM by pablo »

Offline Alan

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #189 on: December 30, 2012, 08:58:05 PM »
It bloody frightning
I see the poll is running at 21 -1.........Any guesses who the 1 might be??

Well it's not me, I voted yes. 


OMG, Its bloody frightening innit!!!!

Offline TBWG

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #190 on: December 30, 2012, 08:58:35 PM »
.

Offline urleft

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #191 on: December 30, 2012, 09:11:32 PM »
So the Aussies banned guns, and so far have successfully avoided a mass killing incident, but find increases in violent crimes, sometimes more that 40%.    And you call that successful?
 
 
 
 
AUSTRALIA: MORE VIOLENT CRIME DESPITE GUN BAN

April 13, 2009

It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer.  In 2002 -- five years after enacting its gun ban -- the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime.  In fact, the percent of murders committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006 (16.3 percent), says the D.C. Examiner.

Even Australia's Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research acknowledges that the gun ban had no significant impact on the amount of gun-involved crime:

•In 2006, assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
•Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
•Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
Moreover, Australia and the United States -- where no gun-ban exists -- both experienced similar decreases in murder rates:

•Between 1995 and 2007, Australia saw a 31.9 percent decrease; without a gun ban, America's rate dropped 31.7 percent.
•During the same time period, all other violent crime indices increased in Australia: assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
•Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
•Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
•At the same time, U.S. violent crime decreased 31.8 percent: rape dropped 19.2 percent; robbery decreased 33.2 percent; aggravated assault dropped 32.2 percent.
•Australian women are now raped over three times as often as American women.
While this doesn't prove that more guns would impact crime rates, it does prove that gun control is a flawed policy.  Furthermore, this highlights the most important point: gun banners promote failed policy regardless of the consequences to the people who must live with them, says the Examiner.

Source: Howard Nemerov, "Australia experiencing more violent crime despite gun ban," D.C. Examiner, April 8, 2009.

For text:

http://www.examiner.com/x-2879-Austin-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m4d8-Australia-experiencing-more-violent-crime-despite-gun-ban

Offline Murtle_71

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #192 on: December 31, 2012, 08:20:12 AM »
We have shootings all the time in Australia

A MAN has been charged over a shooting at a Gold Coast shopping centre that left a man with a gunshot wound to his hand.

The 25-year-old victim was shot when a fight broke out among a group of men in the car park of the Crestwood Plaza shopping centre at Molendinar on October 19.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/national/man-charged-over-shopping-centre-shooting/story-e6frfku9-1226545548664#ixzz2GaVPIdoy


A MAN is in critical condition after being shot in Sydney's south west.

The 21-year-old was found with a wound to his stomach after police were called to Green Valley Rd, Busby, about 11.15pm last night (Sunday) following reports of a shooting.

The man was treated by ambulance paramedics before being taken to Liverpool Hospital where police say he is critical but stable.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/man-shot-in-stomach-in-sydneys-south-west/story-e6frg6n6-1226545615410

It is understood a man shot dead at Punchbowl in Sydney's south west overnight has a family connection to another murder victim from the same suburb.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-12-19/man-shot-dead-in-sydney/4435076

POLICE have seized a gun from a northwestern Sydney home targeted in one of two drive-by shootings as they investigate involvement by an outlaw bikie gang.

Several people were inside the home in the Cherrybrook street when it was hit with multiple bullets about 5.30am (AEDT) on Tuesday.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/shot-fired-at-southwest-sydney-home/story-fn3dxiwe-1226539290998

Offline RonTexas

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #193 on: December 31, 2012, 08:48:54 AM »
self explanatory

Offline Prakhonchai Nick

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Re: Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA
« Reply #194 on: December 31, 2012, 09:04:01 AM »
Self explanatory indeed, but said over 200 years ago just as the 2nd amendment was promulgated more than 200 years ago.

Times change, people change, and at the very least 200 year old laws should be reconsidered and modified if thought necessary for todays needs,


 

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