Yet Another Gun Outrage in USA

[nookiebear]

Stupidity is doing it the UK way:


In 2009 a former soldier, Paul Clarke, found a bag in his garden containing a shotgun. He brought it to the police station and was immediately handcuffed and charged with possession of the gun. At his trial the judge noted: "In law there is no dispute that Mr. Clarke has no defence to this charge. The intention of anybody possessing a firearm is irrelevant." Mr. Clarke was sentenced to five years in prison.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323777204578195470446855466.html

Urleft,,,,,,,,,,,,Happy New Year

[urleft]

And Gun laws are just what dictators want:

[urleft]

Stupidity is doing it the UK way:


In 2009 a former soldier, Paul Clarke, found a bag in his garden containing a shotgun. He brought it to the police station and was immediately handcuffed and charged with possession of the gun. At his trial the judge noted: "In law there is no dispute that Mr. Clarke has no defence to this charge. The intention of anybody possessing a firearm is irrelevant." Mr. Clarke was sentenced to five years in prison.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323777204578195470446855466.html

Urleft,,,,,,,,,,,,Happy New Year

Thanks Paul, and you too, wish you best. 

[CO-CO]

In Mr Clarke case - NOBODY DIED!

Stupid is as stupid does Forrest....

[urleft]

In Mr Clarke case - NOBODY DIED!

Stupid is as stupid does Forrest....

No, but a man was denied his freedom for trying to follow the law, but I guess that is OK by you.

My arguments are for keeping my rights and enjoying my life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.  Yours are for taking away my rights. 


And with the UK's great gun laws, how is this happening:

Gun crime soars by 35%

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-154307/Gun-crime-soars-35.html



I guess we will just have to disagree. 

[mike]

Stupidity is doing it the UK way:


In 2009 a former soldier, Paul Clarke, found a bag in his garden containing a shotgun. He brought it to the police station and was immediately handcuffed and charged with possession of the gun. At his trial the judge noted: "In law there is no dispute that Mr. Clarke has no defence to this charge. The intention of anybody possessing a firearm is irrelevant." Mr. Clarke was sentenced to five years in prison.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323777204578195470446855466.html

Urleft,

Your link  does not point to the article about Paul Clarke.

This is the correct article

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1236976/Soldier-given-suspended-sentence-handing-shotgun-police-given-award-instead.html

                                       and if you care to read it he got a suspended 12 month prison sentence for 12 months.

Apparently he waited 4 days to hand the gun in and this is what the judge said about that ....


'I understand you were once a soldier, and you in particular ought to have appreciated the danger posed by such a weapon and should have asked the police to come and collect it right away.'

Finally the standard sentence is 5 years but due to the unusal aspect of this case it was reduced to the above.

Happy New Year

Mike

[mike]

No, but a man was denied his freedom for trying to follow the law, but I guess that is OK by you.

My arguments are for keeping my rights and enjoying my life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.  Yours are for taking away my rights. 


And with the UK's great gun laws, how is this happening:

Gun crime soars by 35%

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-154307/Gun-crime-soars-35.html



I guess we will just have to disagree.

Urleft,

First of all I guess you agree now that Paul Clarke was not denied his freedom trying to follow the law as you stated above.

Secondly the increase in gun crime figures in the UK a worrying trend over the last few years. At at total of 9,974 gun crimes this is staggering in UK terms - the worst for nearly 20 years. It is also staggering that the homicide rate by firearms increased by 32%. Your article states this is 23 cases, so in total approx 98 cases of homicide by Firearm.

This equates to 98 cases in one whole year.

Below is a link for gun crime in the US.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jan/10/gun-crime-us-state#data

This shows that there was only 8583 homicides by firearm in 2011 in the US.
 
Nearly 100 times as many homicides by firearm in the US than the UK  - Take into account the population diff (US 320M, UK 65M this comes done to approx 20 times as many  -or am I missing something

You should note that I, personally, am not for taking your rights away or any other Americans rights away - it is not for me to decide or judge.

However I do find it amazing that the American population feels safer to live in a society with a high availability of firearms that a society with zero or a very low availability of firearms.

Happy New Year

Mike

[nookiebear]

Enough I think of stupidity, happy new year every one

Unfortunarely the stupidity continues...

Just reading about the 74 year old landlord who shot dead his two tenants over rent and snow clearing disputes.

Some might see this action as an extreme method of concluding a minor row - but, hey no, we musn't  infringe the gunrights of individuals like this - that would just not do.

It is every Americans right to possess a firearm. Never mind that occasionally some old fcuker like this decides to become judge jury and executioner.

It is a small price to pay for freedom!

You reap what you sow.

Thank fcuk it doesn't snow here tooooooooooo often!

[Prakhonchai Nick]

All people in democratic countries with democratically elected governments have rights covering all manner of things.

These rights need to be constantly reviewed to ensure they are in accord with current trends and above all the views of the population.

The right given to bear arms was introduced more than 200 years ago, and was no doubt at that time a very popular move. How does the American population feel about this now? Is there still a majority who want the law to allow the bearing of arms, not just to protect property, but also to be allowed to be carried on the person? Or would the majority vote for changes and restrictions in the gun law? In a democratic society, the views of the people should be listened to and discussed by the lawmakers.

Throughout this thread, whilst many differing views have been expressed, it has been clear that Urleft is only concerned about HIS rights, and has paid little or no attention to the rights of the American population at large to have their views heard and considered.

[Nobby]

Throughout this thread, whilst many differing views have been expressed, it has been clear that Urleft is only concerned about HIS rights, and has paid little or no attention to the rights of the American population at large to have their views heard and considered.

That may be true but he has still remained polite, unthreatening so deserves his right to speak on BE here with us unlike many ex-members. I have never met the man incidently or do I agree with his viewpoint. Lets try not to be Judge Judy and Executioner.    

[Prakhonchai Nick]

Throughout this thread, whilst many differing views have been expressed, it has been clear that Urleft is only concerned about HIS rights, and has paid little or no attention to the rights of the American population at large to have their views heard and considered.

That may be true but he has still remained polite, unthreatening so deserves his right to speak on BE here with us unlike many ex-members. I have never met the man incidently or do I agree with his viewpoint. Lets try not to be Judge Judy and Executioner.    

Well said Nobby.

Urleft has maintained his composure and decorum throughout, despite the assaults and blatant rudeness of some .

Some interesting statistics out today show that Thailand has the 3rd highest gun homicide rate in the world, and the highest number of gun owning people in SE Asia.  The figures are not surprising under the circumstances.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2255671/Stephen-Ashton-British-tourist-22-shot-dead-crossfire-Thai-New-Years-Eve-beach-party.html#ixzz2GlgM0y8r

[nookiebear]

It would be interesting to see how many of those homocides here in Thailand were caused through excessive alcohol intake

[Nobby]

It would be interesting to see how many of those homocides here in Thailand were caused through excessive alcohol intake

True or Road related or Police personell related

[CO-CO]

Throughout this thread, whilst many differing views have been expressed, it has been clear that Urleft is only concerned about HIS rights, and has paid little or no attention to the rights of the American population at large to have their views heard and considered.

That may be true but he has still remained polite, unthreatening so deserves his right to speak on BE here with us unlike many ex-members. I have never met the man incidently or do I agree with his viewpoint. Lets try not to be Judge Judy and Executioner.   

IMO this is what forums are about. You will always get opposing views and BE is a medium to express those views.

I can never agree with Keith's sekfish view about 'rights'. Freedom comes with responsibility and too many people are incapable of that.

Yes, I would certainly sacrifice mine, and othets freedoms, if it made the world a safer place.

I believe URleft's arguments are flawed as evidenced by selective reportage - the Clarke case being a classic example of only quoting the facts that fit one's poibt of view.

For me, more guns = more violence = more deaths.

Gun laws wete introduced to avoid wild west situations occuring and I would say that, per se, the UK isa safer place to be than the USA.

Keith's view that it is better to arm his wife is not one I can share. She is Thai and frankly I wouldn't let any Thai loose even wth a pop gun let alone a loaded weapon!  That said, I respect the fact that Keith is only doing his best to protect his family as he sees fit.

We will never agree but we will always be able to share a glass of cider :-)

[Prakhonchai Nick]

I believe a bottle of Jamesons is on the table should CoCo win Urleft over!